In 2008, Apple launched the App Store for their iPhone product and for the first time, allowed 3rd party developers to build apps for their OS and charge associated fees.
In 2022, that ecosystem generated $1.1 trillion in developer billing and sales, and has driven hundreds of billions of dollars for developers. That ecosystem is now the most lucrative aspect of Apple’s business, and a model for partnership that many businesses would love to emulate.
How would something like that work for your business?
That’s what we’re covering in today’s episode of Partnership Unpacked.
Welcome back to Partnership Unpacked, where I selfishly use this time to pick the brains of experts at strategic partnerships, channel programs, affiliates, influencer marketing, and relationship building… oh, and you get to learn too! Subscribe to learn how you can amplify your growth strategy – with a solid takeaway every episode from partnership experts in the industry.
While you may not be in a position to create the kind of ecosystem that Apple has built with their App Store, perhaps there are simpler, smaller scale approaches you might consider.
If you’re a SaaS tool like Agorapulse, you might find other SaaS tools who could integrate with your product and make those integrations available as apps, as HubSpot has done.
Or perhaps you might work with service providers who, in similar fashion, might offer their services in support of your product and the customers you serve.
In both situations, you’re creating an environment where you’re partnering with other brands in a way that’s different from any we’ve talked about before – marketplaces and ecosystems.
Where do we even begin?
That’s exactly what Jason Lampkin is going to talk to us about.
This Welsh soccer star-turned-partnership professional works for the world-leading freelancer platform, Fiverr, where he leads global partnerships for Fiverr’s cutting-edge marketplace. He brings years of partnership expertise to the fore and is adept at navigating the intricacies and nuance of a massive ecosystem and marketplace.
Partnership Unpacked host Mike Allton talked Jason Lampkin about:
♉️ How Marketplaces & Ecosystem Partnerships Work
♉️ How To Find Great Partners For Your Marketplace
♉️ What Metrics & Incentives To Put In Place To Ensure Success
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Learn more about Jason Lampkin
- Connect with Jason Lampkin on LinkedIn
Resources & Brands mentioned in this episode
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- Learn more about Agorapulse with a free demo
Full Notes & Transcript:
Mike Alton: [00:00:00] In 2008, Apple launched the App Store for their iPhone product and for the first time allowed third party developers to build apps for their OS and charge associated fees. In 2022, that ecosystem generated 1. 1 trillion in developer billing and sales, and has driven hundreds of billions of dollars for developers.
That ecosystem is now the most lucrative aspect of Apple’s business and a model for partnership that many businesses would love to emulate. How would something like that. Work for your business? That’s what we’re covering in today’s episode of Partnership Unpacked.
This is Partnership Unpacked, your go to guide to growing your business through partnerships quickly. I’m your host, Mike Alton, and each episode unpacks the winning strategies and latest trends from influencer marketing to brand partnerships and [00:01:00] ideas that you can apply to your own business to grow exponentially.
And now, the rest.
Welcome back to Partnership Unpacked where I selfishly use this time to pick the brains of experts at strategic partnerships, channel programs, affiliates, influencer marketing, relationship building. Oh, and you get to learn to subscribe to learn how you can amplify your growth strategy with a solid takeaway every episode from partnership experts in the industry.
And while you may not be in a position to create the kind of ecosystem that Apple has built with their app store, perhaps there are simpler, smaller scale approaches you might consider. Thank If you’re a SaaS tool like Agorapulse, you might find other SaaS tools who could integrate with your product and make those integrations available as apps.
As HubSpot has done, or perhaps you might work with a service provider who in similar fashion might offer their services in support of your product and the customers you serve. In both situations, you’re creating an [00:02:00] environment where you’re partnering with other brands in a way that’s different from any we’ve talked about before, marketplaces and ecosystems.
Where do we begin? Well, that’s exactly what Jason Lampkin is going to talk to us about. This Welsh soccer star turned partnership professional works for the world leading freelancer platform Fiverr, where he leads global partnerships for Fiverr’s cutting edge marketplace. He brings years of partnership expertise to the fore and is adept at navigating the intricacies and nuance of a massive ecosystem and marketplace.
Hey, Jason, welcome to the show.
Jason Lampkin: Thank you, Mike! That was a super professional and polished introduction there. So I will do my best to follow on from that as the. Listeners will probably hear and as the viewers will see, my setup isn’t as professional as yours. So I’ve got some making up to do, but hopefully we can have a good chat and dive into some real interesting topics.
Mike Alton: No, this is going to be fantastic. And tell folks where you’re actually recording from.
Jason Lampkin: Yeah. The accent throws people off. I’ve now got a bit of a transatlantic accent. So I’m originally from North Wales. I’ve also lived in [00:03:00] Birmingham, UK, London, UK, which are distinct accents, but I’ve been in the U.S. Now for on and off about 12 years.
I’ve always been based on the East Coast. So started in Long Island University, headed into Brooklyn, and now I find myself in Manhattan. Our headquarters in the U. S. for Fiverr is in Soho, uh, so I’m in the hustle and bustle of it all.
Mike Alton: That’s fantastic. And yeah, you can tell, for those of you listening, you can tell Jason’s working in a, in a nice corporate building in Manhattan.
So yes, he does have that leg up on me, and I’m actually drinking my Welsh Glengiddy tea in your honor, Jason.
Jason Lampkin: Love it. Love it.. I’m half Spanish. So I’ve got an acquired taste and I don’t quite take to English tea. I also don’t drink beer. And my dad’s very disappointed, but we’ll gloss over that.
Mike Alton: Fantastic.
So how did you even get started in partnerships? Like I said, you were a soccer star. And what can you tell me about Fiverr’s new marketplace?
Jason Lampkin: It’s been a while since someone described me as a soccer star [00:04:00] and it feels nice, but it makes me feel a little nostalgic at the same time, but you’re exactly right.
So my trajectory was, I was supposed to be the next Michael Owen. That name might not mean much to you, but to people in the UK, it’s a pretty big deal. The reason why is because my game was very similar to Michael Owen’s. I also grew up in the town that Michael Owen grew up. I went to the same primary school, high school.
And as I say, we had similar traits. I was very fast. So that’s who I was supposed to be, the next Michael Owen. Uh, unfortunately, I had Michael Owen’s injuries way before he did. So I didn’t have the glittering career and all the goals that he had. Unfortunately, a week before my 18th birthday, I had a very bad knee injury when I was in the academy at Aston Villa.
So I tore my ACL, my MCL, and. Both medial and lateral menisci, which if you know much about athletics or sport, you know, it’s pretty much a death sentence. Yeah. For a soccer player. That said, I knew that my, after the recovery, I knew that my body was good enough to still get something out of the game. [00:05:00] So the next best plan B for me was to embark on a soccer scholarship.
So that’s what I did. I went to Long Island University out here in New York where I achieved my bachelor’s in business and my M B A. And then throughout the years, I’ve gained experience as a non athletic, regular person. That’s what they term us. In mostly partnership roles, I think I’ve translated my career in soccer to my career in business quite well.
Obviously in soccer, it’s, it’s all about partnerships, both internally and externally. So everything that I learned through my career as a sportsman, I’ve brought with me into the business world. I’ve worked with companies like ClassPass, FreeTrain, Fitnessity, and I now find myself at Fiverr.
Mike Alton: I’m thinking of putting non athletic regular person as my tagline.
No, that’s terrific. I love that you’ve brought that athleticism and that experience with that game into your professional career. That’s fantastic. [00:06:00] Now, as I mentioned in that introduction, marketplaces and ecosystems, that’s a topic we have not talked about on this podcast. Would you mind sharing what you think they are in this business context, of course, and what the benefits to assess brand might be?
Jason Lampkin: Absolutely. So hopefully. Your listeners are familiar with Fiverr, it’s the world leading talent marketplace. We’ve been around for about 14 years now. Specifically, I’m on a team called Fiverr Certified, which has only been around publicly for about three months. But in totality, it’s been under the radar, I’d say for about eight to nine months.
Now marketplaces, hopefully, again, your listeners are familiar with the concept of marketplaces. But I’ll kind of tailor it towards the SAS brands. So an ecosystem essentially serves as a platform that connects businesses with a network of specialized freelancers or experts. And that’s particularly what we’re trying to do with Fiverr certified.
So we’re building dedicated co branded talent marketplaces. with the likes of Agorapulse, but also Monday, Stripe, WooCommerce, Amazon, [00:07:00] to enable them to offer customized solutions to their customers. Now, it’s always done with the partner’s collaboration and input. So we always discover three to five typically service gaps that these partners have.
And those are the gaps that we aim to fill with expert freelancers.
Mike Alton: And as you mentioned, you and I’ve been working together. This is how we met on building a marketplace like that for Agorapulse. Agorapulse is, as most of you know, who are listening, it’s a social media management tool. We don’t offer any services whatsoever outside support of our own tool.
Our number one user segment is actually marketing agencies. We’re using our tool with their customers and clients to help them. The end user manage their social media. So we worked with, with you, Jason, and with Fiverr to build that certified marketplace that’s filled with agencies who are not only vetted by Fiverr, but they’re certified in Agorapulse and so Fiverr users or anyone who’s looking for social media management solutions, they can come to that Fiverr certified marketplace [00:08:00] and find folks who are not only going to help them with social media.
But they, they know that they’re certified in the tool that they’re represented.
Jason Lampkin: Exactly right. That’s the important part. So Fiverr, we can go and vet and verify the talent that we think would be a great fit for the partner’s marketplace. But we also want that stamp of approval from the partner to say, yes, this person is an expert, but they’ve also gone through a certification.
Specific to our technology. That’s the really important part of that. So whenever a customer visits that marketplace, they’re looking for a very specific solution and they will find the top 0. 1 percent of experts who can help them with that. The entire mission with Fiverr certified is to turbocharge our partners, renewals, growth, and upsells.
Mike Alton: Awesome. Awesome. And we love it. We’re starting to recommend, you know, that our. End user audience. They’re reading our blog posts and that kinda stuff, learning about Instagram reels and all the things that we talk about through our content. You know, we’re saying, Hey, if you want more help, go check out this marketplace where you can find agencies are already vetted and they’re certified in Agorapulse.
So that’s the Fiverr [00:09:00] certified marketplace. Now, if we’re talking about marketplaces more generally speaking, what do you think makes for a great marketplace?
Jason Lampkin: There’s a number of things that come into that. I would say it always depends on what the partner wants from it. So we have real in depth exploratory conversations with all of our partners.
We like to determine where they’re currently experiencing service gaps, and then we tailor the marketplace to that. I think One of the things that really is important is to have a range of services, solutions, and options on there. So all of the agencies and experts that we onboard onto our marketplace, for instance, they set their own rates.
They determine which services they would like to offer. Uh, it’s their time and it’s their skill set. So we empower them to do so. And then anybody who comes looking for a solution to that marketplace pretty much knows that this person can help me with exactly what I’m looking for. Now, marketplaces in general, there’s, you know, it depends really what we’re.
We’re talking about here, but another marketplace that I did work with was class pass. So class pass is kind of a [00:10:00] fitness aggregator. So if you don’t want a membership to one specific gym, you would join class pass. It then gives you access to a whole range of classes, whole range of gyms that you can choose from.
And I think that really from the customer perspective is, is massive value because they they’re exposed. It’s a discovery tool, so they can see. All of these different options, they see the different pricing, the services that are listed. So there’s a lot of benefits that do come from marketplaces.
Mike Alton: Love it.
So you mentioned that you’re taking the time to think through who should actually be partner of Fiverr in this respect. Did you go into a little more detail? How do you actually identify and vet those potential partners for participating in a marketplace like yours? So
Jason Lampkin: do we mean here the partner such as agorapulse or the partner such as the expert that would be listed?
Mike Alton: Oh, now there’s an excellent question. You could go either way. I was thinking about in your case agorapulse is the partner
Jason Lampkin: Yep, right [00:11:00] So the way that we identify partners that we work with, a number of ways. Number one, we can utilize the traffic that comes through the regular Fiverr marketplace. That’s always a good indicator.
If we see that a SaaS company or a digital enterprise has sellers already listing services directly related to that technology, that signals two things. Number one, that we can provide talent if we were to build a certified marketplace. But number two, that people are already coming to the Fiverr marketplace looking for solutions directly related to that technology.
So it’s a bit of an alarm bell for us. And it signals that a certified marketplace probably would make sense. So that’s the first way that we go about it. Then, of course, it’s about jumping on a call and figuring out exactly where things fit. Quite often, a lot of our partners have some sort of solution already, whether they have an expert marketplace, a partner directory, sometimes even an in house professional services team.
Now, I would say this is not a competitive product, a certified marketplace. We actually see it as an [00:12:00] enhancement or an add on to the existing customer support. A lot of our partners, by the way, do have partner directories already or an established solution. Certified Marketplace, in that case, is that extension of that support.
It also allows them to A B test whether they want to send some customer support queries to their existing partners. And send others to a certified marketplace. We really need to find an, an explore with a partner where this fits best.
Mike Alton: It makes perfect sense because at Agorapulse previously we’d actually built our own solution, an entirely different website.
It was supposed to be a way for anyone to find an agency that would serve their needs or their specific marketing needs and geography, regardless of whether they were an Agorapulse certified user or not, that didn’t work for us. That’s basically been mothballed. We looked at purchasing a solution that would have provided a directory that would have like lived on our own site.
And that [00:13:00] cost was a lot. Let’s just say, you know, you came to me at the perfect time because that made a lot of sense for me. Now, for those of you listening. Another way to think about finding, inventing potential partners that we’re also doing here to go repulse is we’re going back to our end users and we’re asking them what other pieces of technology are you currently using?
Because again, we’re a sass tool, right? So, you know, not obviously there’s social media tools, but what are you using for your CRM? What are you using for project management? Those kinds of solutions that would be complimentary to us because those are solutions that we should either a integrate Thank you.
Or be partnered with in some other way.
Jason Lampkin: Absolutely right. There’s a lot that you can learn from your existing customer base. And partners quite often say to us, customers have already told us they’re going to Fiverr looking for these solutions. This just gives them kind of that formal or professional channel to support our customers and, and, you know, refer them to a certified marketplace that has been built with that collaboration and input.
Mike Alton: Fantastic. So we’re building a marketplace for bringing [00:14:00] in partners, what metrics or requirements should one put in place to ensure that ROI from the partners? And what about incentives to use incentives?
Jason Lampkin: Yes, absolutely. So we’re fully aware that the success of Fiverr certified is fully dependent on the success of the partners.
First, that’s actually really what I like about these kinds of partnerships is that if the partner is not successful. Neither are we. So it’s in our best interest and the partner’s interest that we really pull as many levers as possible to make sure that the marketplace does what it’s supposed to do.
Now, obviously within that there is a framework. Fiverr needs to make sure that when we invest our resources into building, managing and operating these marketplaces, that they do what they’re inherently designed to do. Support our partners customers. So again, kind of touching on a previous question that you asked, how do we vet the partners?
Well, we need to make sure that there is that demand from their customers for these kind of solutions. If there’s not, there’s not really a service gap that we can fill. So the [00:15:00] incentive again ties into this, because if the partner does have A lot of demand from their customers, they see that customers frequently reach out for XYZ.
They say, Hey, I really need support. And the partner has to say to them, unfortunately, we don’t have anything that we can offer you. That is where we fit. So obviously building this dedicated marketplace of expert talent, the partner can now say, Hey, thank you for reaching out. Here is where you can find.
This marketplace that we’ve built in collaboration with Fiverr. Here is where you will find experts who can help you with X, Y, Z, and they’ll help you better utilize your experience or better monetize our tech. That is exactly what we’re hoping for. Exactly what we’re seeing now as well with the Fiverr certified marketplaces.
So really onwards and upwards, we’re excited to show you what we can do with the Agora Pulse. Marketplace to
Mike Alton: fantastic. So we’re talking about marketplaces and ecosystems, which are not only going to help you grow your existing customer base. They’re going to help you retain your customers [00:16:00] long term, because if I’m sending more business to my Agorapulse agency clients, as a result of them being a part of my marketplace, they’re going to continue to grow.
They’re going to be happy. They’re going to stay there. Now, I’m going to share with you a quick message from our CMO, Darrell Prail, about another channel you might want to think about investing in.
Darryl Praill: It’s the Arc de Triomphe. Can you imagine if you’re in charge, if you’re the CMO of Marketing Paris, what are your main channels?
Wow, there’s tons of channels. The Arc de Triomphe. There’s the Eiffel Tower. There’s the Louvre. Those are your channels you’re going to use to drive tourism dollars in. Okay, now, but you’re not the CMO of Paris. In fact, you’re the CMO of your company, product, service. So what are your main channels? Well, I’m going to guess they’re things like pay per click, maybe trade shows events, maybe content.
Those are all pretty predictable, right? Let me ask you this question. Are you treating social media as a main channel? By the way, only 1. 8 percent of you today measure social media and can prove an ROI in that [00:17:00] investment. HubSpot and Gartner say social media is the number one channel to invest in this year.
Are you doing it? If not, I can tell you why. You’re not doing it because you don’t have the tools. You don’t have the mentality, and that’s okay. We’ve got you covered. You change the mentality, we’ll give you the tools. Agorapulse tracks all the ROI for you. One place to manage all your social media activity.
Your number one channel. Change your success. Treat social media as a channel. One CMO to another. My name is Darryl. I’m with Agorpulse. I’ll talk to you soon.
Mike Alton: Alright, Jason, now this is fascinating. My next question I wanna ask about onboarding partners, and I know this can get a little confusing because we’re talking about partners and we’re, we’re also talking about partners of the partners, right? So in your case, we’ve got a marketplace, let’s focus on your partners, which would be mm-hmm.
like Agora Pulse. Yeah. And once you’ve got that new partner, Or your marketplace or ecosystem, [00:18:00] what advice do you have when it comes to onboarding? We want to make sure they get ramped up as fast and as successfully as possible.
Jason Lampkin: Yeah, a strong start is very important. So we do have a partner playbook, which kind of outlines the best strategies that we see.
Partners drive success from things like customer support channels. So making sure that the partner has that flow built in from the moment the marketplace goes live. So when someone reaches out and says, Hey, I’m loving Agorapulse, but I need help with this. The partner can then send them a link to the certified marketplace that pulls people in, they’ll find experts.
And it does what it’s designed to do, support that customer. Other ways that we’ve found success, uh, I can’t touch on specific examples, but I kind of paint broad strokes here. Onboarding and post sale flows as well. So when, and quite often our partners say to us, we don’t see a very good conversion from the free trial or the freemium version.
What can we do about that? What we propose there is that, again, they utilize these [00:19:00] certified marketplaces. The reason why is because once someone has this expert guidance at that very start. Of using the technology. We find that that translates to these conversions, upsells and renewals. So let’s say somebody just signed up to the Agorapulse free trial.
They’re looking for help with running a campaign. That is where Agorapulse can say, Hey, great to have you on board. Here is where you can find an expert who can help you through that process. Make sure that they’re being given the support that they need. Everything’s fully integrated. They achieve the results that they want that they’re hoping for from using your technology.
You’re exactly right. It’s kind of that business to business to business model. But everybody wins in that. Not only is Agorapulse serving that customer better, that customer is better utilizing your tech. The expert is obviously getting work from that as well. And the end goal is that that customer is an Agorapulse customer for the long term.
Maybe they’ll even convert. Maybe they’ll go to a [00:20:00] higher tier plan. That’s the thought process.
Mike Alton: Fantastic. And I know from some of the marketplaces and ecosystems that I’ve seen, those steps that people can do, businesses can do is promote some of their best performing partners within that marketplace. I mean, you log into the apple app store, you’re going to see, you know, featured apps, you’re going to see content about some of the apps.
What’s new, what’s popular, what’s trending. Brands can do the exact same thing with their partners and help promote their partners within the marketplace itself. Right.
Jason Lampkin: Exactly right. Yeah, we actually find that that’s a way for our partners to champion perhaps some of their best users, some experts, obviously, when they’re coming onto the certified marketplaces, not only are they getting the traffic from the partner.
But also Fiverr is utilizing this traffic and sending traffic their way. So it really exposes them to a global network of customers. And of course, we handle all of the liability, the NDAs, the communications, and the payments. So again, it’s that win win win.
Mike Alton: Fantastic. Now, I’m really curious about the [00:21:00] tools that your team is using to manage something like a marketplace.
Because you’ve got multiple partners, there are different stages of, you know, onboarding and success. What kind of tools are you using?
Jason Lampkin: So Fiverr certified is effectively a startup within Fiverr. So we have a lot of flexibility. We’ve been utilizing a lot of different tools. One of the big ones that we do utilize is Monday.
It’s an Israeli company. The CEO of Monday actually sits on our board as well. So maybe there’s a bit of backscratching involved there, but that’s a really good tool that we’re using to track the onboarding process of the partners. Uh, we also utilize Salesforce of course, uh, who doesn’t these days and.
Really, every partner that we onboard, uh, we test out their technology as well. We like to poke holes, figure out where there may be more service gaps. Uh, so that’s something that we do do. But as I say, right now, Fiverr Certified has only been live publicly for about three months, which is great because we get to figure out things along the way.
Uh, it’s very much a start upy vibe. So there’s a lot of tech and tools [00:22:00] that we’re currently trying out, figuring out what works exactly for us.
Mike Alton: Love it. Love it. Even though we’re not a startup, Agorapulse often feels the same way. The list of tools that we’re currently using and testing and you know, off boarding and onboarding is even overwhelming to a new hire.
They’re like, wait, I have to learn all these tools. It’s important to bring different tools and explore what they can do to help build in efficiencies. I mean, I have at least one vendor call a week to look at a different tool that I might use.
Jason Lampkin: Absolutely right. Absolutely right.
Mike Alton: I’ve got just one more question for you.
And this is my absolute favorite question. I ask this of every single guest because I can’t wait to hear how you respond. How important have relationships been to your career?
Jason Lampkin: Crucial. Obviously, I’ll touch on it. My accent is pretty clear, but I am not from the US, so it was really important for me when I came over here to start building relationships pretty much from scratch.
Now I’d already done that from [00:23:00] the UK. The way that I found my scholarship actually is that I emailed every soccer coach at a university in the U.S. And let them know about my professional history, about my past and about my desire to come to the U.S. On a soccer scholarship. So I’d already been building relationships that way.
Um, and one thing I’ll note is that. Building relationships is important, but it’s the effort you put into them as well. It’s a lot like soccer, you’ve got to nurture that relationship to kind of achieve that team goal. But if you don’t do the work, then you’re not going to get the results. I was under the illusion in my early days of my career when I went to a networking event that something would immediately happen the day after, and I was disappointed if I met someone from a big company, I wasn’t the CEO of their company the next day.
But it’s definitely kind of a long game, you’ve got to be patient. And really again, I’ll touch upon it, but it’s got to be win win. I know we hear that all the time. And sometimes it’s even an alarm bell. When you hear that from someone that, Oh, Hey, I want to make sure this is a win win for us. [00:24:00] Uh, it can actually mean sometimes the opposite, but I truly believe that.
And you know, every company I’ve worked with, it’s been the same kind of thing. It’s never been selling a product. It’s all about being a partner to the companies that we’ve worked with. We’ve never been successful. If a partner wasn’t successful first, uh, and that’s really where. Where our mindset is we’re certified.
So I guess in my personal life and in my career, relationships have been extremely important. But, I think it always comes down to the individual. How much work are you willing to put in, and how much are you willing to give back to the other partner or the other person involved in that relationship?
Mike Alton: Such fantastic advice, top to bottom. You’ve really honed in on and stressed the very reasons why I ask that question every single time because I want to. Impress upon my listeners, you can’t say it enough that it needs to be a win win situation, a win win win situation, particularly in partnerships. So thank you for sharing that.
Thank you for reiterating that. Jason, this has been fantastic. Such a great [00:25:00] interview. So much fun. Tell folks where they can find you, where they can reach out if they want to learn more.
Jason Lampkin: I’m not very active on social media, but LinkedIn, Jason Severiano Lampkin, it’s a unique middle name there. I was actually named.
Severiano Lampkin, my dad was a big fan. Fortunately, it wasn’t my first name because it would have been a bit tricky for people in the UK to pronounce that. So we went with Jason, but if you type in Jason Severiano Lampkin, you’ll certainly find me. As I say, not very active on Instagram. I do have an account, but you’ll see one post over the past.
Three or four years. So I don’t bother that
Mike Alton: awesome. I think I can hook you up with a social media tool to help you with that activity. Jason friends. That is all we’ve got for today. I will have all of Jason’s links in the show notes. I hope you check them out. Hope you follow them and definitely check out that Fiverr certified marketplace.
Until next time, have a great day. Thank you for listening to another episode of partnership unpacked hosted by Mike Alton and powered by Agorapulse, the number one rated social media management solution. [00:26:00] which you can learn more about at agorapulse. com. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe on your favorite podcast player.
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Until next time.